Comments on: An Explanation of Slope http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/ Northern California Golf Association Fri, 24 May 2013 19:02:15 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Jim Cowan http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-4597 Jim Cowan Tue, 01 Mar 2011 15:09:29 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-4597 Derek, thank you for your comment. ESC has breakpoints every 10 strokes. At this particular breakpoint, the gap in the maximum score that can be posted is two strokes instead of one for par threes (no gap for par fives between those 10-19 and under 10). Personally I don't lose any sleep over this. If you think about it, single-digit handicappers post very few sixes on par threes so it is almost a moot point. And on that rare occasion that a single-digit does record a triple bogey on a par three, that round rarely is selected among the best 10 of 20 rounds that goes into the actual handicap calculation meaning that the Handicap Index is not impacted. So, it may not "feel" right, but it has little or no impact on the handicaps that are produced. Thanks again - Jim Cowan Derek, thank you for your comment. ESC has breakpoints every 10 strokes. At this particular breakpoint, the gap in the maximum score that can be posted is two strokes instead of one for par threes (no gap for par fives between those 10-19 and under 10). Personally I don’t lose any sleep over this. If you think about it, single-digit handicappers post very few sixes on par threes so it is almost a moot point. And on that rare occasion that a single-digit does record a triple bogey on a par three, that round rarely is selected among the best 10 of 20 rounds that goes into the actual handicap calculation meaning that the Handicap Index is not impacted. So, it may not “feel” right, but it has little or no impact on the handicaps that are produced. Thanks again – Jim Cowan

]]> By: Derek Granfield http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-4595 Derek Granfield Mon, 28 Feb 2011 19:16:12 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-4595 Jim, Question regarding E S C. Why is it that a 9 handicap golfer can only take a 5 on a par three, yet a 10 handicap must take a 7. Seems unfair. Please explain. Thank You. Derek Jim,

Question regarding E S C. Why is it that a 9 handicap golfer can only take a 5 on a par three, yet a 10 handicap must take a 7. Seems unfair. Please explain. Thank You. Derek

]]> By: Jim Cowan http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-3967 Jim Cowan Mon, 30 Aug 2010 21:49:43 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-3967 Ronald, thank you for your comment. Nothing that you included in quotation marks conflicts with anything the NCGA has ever stated. Slope is based on the gap between the Course Rating and Bogey Rating . . . the wider the gap, the higher the Slope. Slope still doesn't tell you which course is tougher (i.e., which course we would expect higher scores at). You need the Course and Slope Rating to estimate that. Thanks - Jim Cowan Ronald, thank you for your comment. Nothing that you included in quotation marks conflicts with anything the NCGA has ever stated. Slope is based on the gap between the Course Rating and Bogey Rating . . . the wider the gap, the higher the Slope. Slope still doesn’t tell you which course is tougher (i.e., which course we would expect higher scores at). You need the Course and Slope Rating to estimate that. Thanks – Jim Cowan

]]> By: Ronald J Plachy http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-3966 Ronald J Plachy Mon, 30 Aug 2010 20:32:51 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-3966 Found an article on the USGA site, "The Truth About Slope." it states, "Slope is based on the difficulty of golf courses." It further states, "The Slope of a more difficult course-the gap between the score of a scratch player and a bogey golfer-is steeper than an easier course, producing a higher Slope. A Slope of 113 signifies a course of average difficulty; 155 is the highest possible Slope, while 55 is the lowest." Seems the NCGA does not concur with the USGA! Found an article on the USGA site, “The Truth About Slope.” it states, “Slope is based on the difficulty of golf courses.” It further states, “The Slope of a more difficult course-the gap between the score of a scratch player and a bogey golfer-is steeper than an easier course, producing a higher Slope. A Slope of 113 signifies a course of average difficulty; 155 is the highest possible Slope, while 55 is the lowest.”

Seems the NCGA does not concur with the USGA!

]]> By: Jim Cowan http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-1431 Jim Cowan Tue, 20 Jan 2009 19:14:47 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-1431 John, thank you for your comment. I am going to direct you to a previous column we ran on this very subject entitled "Competing From Different Sets of Tees." This column appears on the same list of Handicap Resources that you found the Slope article. In order to level the playing field between golfers competing from different tees, you need to take into account the difference in the Course Ratings between the two tees. Basically you round the difference and award the additional strokes to the golfer playing the tee with the higher Course Rating. So if the Blue tees are rated 2.7 strokes higher than White, the Blue tee golfer is awarded three strokes above and beyond what he would normally receive from those tees. I hope this answers your question. Again, the column I referenced offers more details. Thanks again - Jim Cowan John, thank you for your comment. I am going to direct you to a previous column we ran on this very subject entitled “Competing From Different Sets of Tees.” This column appears on the same list of Handicap Resources that you found the Slope article. In order to level the playing field between golfers competing from different tees, you need to take into account the difference in the Course Ratings between the two tees. Basically you round the difference and award the additional strokes to the golfer playing the tee with the higher Course Rating. So if the Blue tees are rated 2.7 strokes higher than White, the Blue tee golfer is awarded three strokes above and beyond what he would normally receive from those tees. I hope this answers your question. Again, the column I referenced offers more details. Thanks again – Jim Cowan

]]> By: John Pedicini http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-1415 John Pedicini Sun, 18 Jan 2009 07:23:16 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-1415 Jim Very good, succinct explanation of rated par and slope. I have noticed that it is difficult to equate handicaps between various tees on the same course. This leads to problems when a player using the blue tees plays another using the white tees. How do you come up with a fair bet? Jim
Very good, succinct explanation of rated par and slope. I have noticed that it is difficult to equate handicaps between various tees on the same course. This leads to problems when a player using the blue tees plays another using the white tees. How do you come up with a fair bet?

]]> By: Jim Cowan http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-1074 Jim Cowan Wed, 03 Sep 2008 02:57:39 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-1074 Peter Stern, thank you for your comment. This gets a little technical, but on a golf course of perfect proportionate difficulty, we would expect the 20-handicapper to score 21 strokes higher than the scratch golfer. Why, because handicaps are based on 96% of the difference between, basically, our scores and the Course Rating. 21 times 5.381 equals 113, the Slope Rating for a course of perfect proportionate difficulty. Thanks again - Jim Cowan Peter Stern, thank you for your comment. This gets a little technical, but on a golf course of perfect proportionate difficulty, we would expect the 20-handicapper to score 21 strokes higher than the scratch golfer. Why, because handicaps are based on 96% of the difference between, basically, our scores and the Course Rating. 21 times 5.381 equals 113, the Slope Rating for a course of perfect proportionate difficulty. Thanks again – Jim Cowan

]]> By: Jim Cowan http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-1073 Jim Cowan Wed, 03 Sep 2008 02:54:12 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-1073 John Justice, thank you for your comment. Comparing Slope Ratings from one course to another is not a good proposition, so we do not have any sort of hot-line that someone can contact regarding our ratings. Nor are we prepared to respond to 170,000 different opinions on a course's numbers. Besides, just because a course plays more or less difficult for one particular golfer than another, it is not an indication that one or both ratings are off. It is probably more an indication that one course leant itself to a golfer's game better than the other. Thanks again - Jim Cowan. John Justice, thank you for your comment. Comparing Slope Ratings from one course to another is not a good proposition, so we do not have any sort of hot-line that someone can contact regarding our ratings. Nor are we prepared to respond to 170,000 different opinions on a course’s numbers. Besides, just because a course plays more or less difficult for one particular golfer than another, it is not an indication that one or both ratings are off. It is probably more an indication that one course leant itself to a golfer’s game better than the other. Thanks again – Jim Cowan.

]]> By: Peter Stern http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-1064 Peter Stern Tue, 02 Sep 2008 04:11:52 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-1064 Jim, There are two constants that you have mentioned used in the overall slope/course handicap calculations. 113 and 5.381 How were these derived? Thanks. Jim,
There are two constants that you have mentioned used in the overall
slope/course handicap calculations. 113 and 5.381 How were these
derived? Thanks.

]]> By: john justice http://www.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/comment-page-1/#comment-1050 john justice Sun, 24 Aug 2008 16:45:26 +0000 http://thebacknine.ncga.org/2007/06/18/an-explanation-of-slope/#comment-1050 Jim thanks for the Q&A section. I have had a problem with the slope ratings, now I have a better idea of what the ratings mean. If I play a course that I feel is rated wrong is there a place to write to and bring it to someone's attention? thanks Jim thanks for the Q&A section. I have had a problem with the slope ratings, now I have a better idea of what the ratings mean. If I play a course that I feel is rated wrong is there a place to write to and bring it to someone’s attention? thanks

]]>